Sean Malin is a Comedy Columnist and Writer at Vulture, New York Magazine’s culture vertical.
In this episode of Coffee with a Journalist, comedy columnist Sean Malin of Vulture and New York Magazine shares a behind-the-scenes look at his upcoming book, The Podcast Pantheon—a definitive guide to the most influential podcasts of our time. Sean gets candid about what makes a pitch stand out, the role publicists play (the good, the bad, and the blacklist), and how he uncovers eccentric stories in unexpected places. Whether you’re in media or just love smart, funny takes on culture, this convo delivers.
Click below to listen to the full conversation and read below for highlights from the interview:
[0:12:33] SM: We all got to work. I respect it, but it's like, I am somebody who I don't take my work home with me. I'm on when I'm on. I'm off when I'm off. If I'm reading your email, please add a little joy to my life. I'll try to be polite and friendly to you. I don't get in arguments with any publicist ever. We're not going to have a problem.
[0:12:51] BB: I love that. I'm not getting in arguments. It's good. Okay. Yeah. Okay. I don't hear often on this show, Sean, where people say like, I'll leave the work. What's your boundary on this? By the way, especially with someone like you, who I imagine you're going to shows, you're going to things.
[0:13:09] SM: Correct.
[0:13:10] BB: Leave all the time. How are you doing this?
[0:13:13] SM: I mean, it's not that I can shut off what my role is when I go to a comedy show, or when I'm interviewing somebody for a podcast. If we're having a social occasion, I will make very clear, I'm off record here, we're not on background. We're not doing any work. We're just getting to know each other as collaborators.
[0:13:34] BB: Good.
[0:13:34] SM: In terms of hours, when I sit down on my computer in the morning is usually around 9.00, 8.30 sometimes, my email is on do not disturb at 7.00. That's it. You can't access me.
[0:13:48] BB: Okay. That's it. how long have you held that boundary up?
[0:13:53] SM: I went to graduate school and then graduate school for media studies. If you checked your phone, you weren't getting your work. It was a 14-hour day. I also worked on film and TV production sets. It was like, you had to have your phone open all that time. After I stopped that, I said, I'm never going to do that again. I mean, it was purely painful to work 12 hours, 14-hour days. I'm not that person. Are you that kind of person, Beck? Are you a 14-hour a day person?
[0:14:21] BB: I am a high performance, high intensity person. Thanks for asking, Sean. No one usually asks me questions. This is fun. I have a lot of capacity, a lot of energy and I love what I do. My thing as a founder, right, which is you're just loving what you do. You get into it and you just love it, and so forth. I have to have the discipline with myself as many founders have to eventually learn of like, okay, tonight, I'm going to my Krav Maga class. I got to go physically to the class when I'm there and I'm punching people, choking people, guess what? You're not doing an email. You can't be doing an email. I'm really disciplined now on it, because you for me, and I imagine this is the case with some reporters, you could just go on. You could just go on.
[0:15:03] SM: That's true.
[0:15:04] BB: The biggest fallacy I think in adulting is learning like, oh, there's always work. There's always more work.
[0:15:10] SM: That's right.
[0:15:10] BB: I could work more.
[0:15:12] SM: Yeah, and my work is also at home, I consume culture for a living. I watch TV for a living. I watch comedy specials. It's not like –
[0:15:19] BB: Just constantly.
[0:15:20] SM: When I say, I'm going to turn off, I mean, I'm turning off access to me. It's not that I'm not still consuming or absorbing, but I'm not responding to emails. I'm not taking phone calls. I have in the past, every so often, recriminated, or sternly wrote back to a publicist saying, “Hey, you sent me something at 10 p.m. that just arrived at my house. I was asleep. Please don't do that. Please, have some conscientiousness of the fact that I'm a human being in my house at that time, napping.” People have boundary issues in this industry. Some publicists, especially. I think if you just have really clear boundaries with them, almost all 99.9% respect it.
[0:16:02] BB: Yes. I think honestly, a lot of people would like more boundaries for themselves and to know them for others.
[0:16:08] SM: It's true. It's not easy to learn. You can only learn the hard way by stepping over somebody's line.
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[0:16:14] BB: What's the best pitch you've gotten lately, Sean? I know you came prepared with some pitches you liked.
[0:16:22] SM: Yeah. Well, pitching me is a really easy thing to do, because for my column, I always have to produce. Of course, I field pitches for food, for comedy, for travel as a culture writer. I got one. This was one that I got not for New York Magazine, but for a different publication that became a feature story in the New York Times. The subject line was Dick Pics Not Welcome. Profile Managed by Mom. It was about a Jewish dating service that is managed by your mother.
[0:16:52] BB: Oh, my God. Oh, my God.
[0:16:55] SM: It became a full happy spread in the times. I mean, it was a great, great pitch. I mean, so good.
[0:17:01] BB: High five to that publicist. Oh, yeah.
[0:17:05] SM: Then, I just a very simple, somebody sent me end of year podcast coverage. Would you consider? They just say, would you consider? Very nice, very polite. Maybe even a little genteel.
[0:17:17] BB: Wait, was he asked, would you consider including this in your round up?
[0:17:22] SM: Yes. Exactly.
[0:17:23] BB: Oh, I like this. That's nice. Okay.
[0:17:26] SM: It's almost gentlemanly.
[0:17:27] BB: It is. Yes.
[0:17:29] SM: Would you consider?
[0:17:30] BB: Okay. On that point though, there's some pitches and a lot of people on the show are like, “No, I don't want to hear, “Oh, Sean. I hope your weekend was great. Did you see any fun shows? Okay, now I want to talk.”” Do you want straight to the point? Just get into it. Forget that. I don't want that crap.
[0:17:46] SM: I like a little salutation. It's nice to say, “I hope you're all right.”
[0:17:51] BB: Okay. I hope you're alive. Okay. Good. Yup. Yeah.
[0:17:54] SM: Have you heard this thing where people, there's the meme of how your email finds me. I hope this email finds you well, and then there’s a picture of a dumpster fire.
[0:17:59] BB: Oh, God. Yes. Yeah, exactly.
[0:18:02] SM: I actually really like being asked, hope you had a good weekend. Here's my pitch. Again, we're human beings talking. We're not automatons. Treat me like one, I'll treat you like one.
[0:19:07] BB: Okay. I would like to do my quick-fire list with you, Sean. Are you ready for it?
[0:19:18] SM: I'm ready.
[0:19:19] BB: Okay. Video or phone interview?
[0:19:21] SM: Video all the way.
[0:19:23] BB: Why, by the way?
[0:19:25] SM: I love talking to people.
[0:19:26] BB: You love talking to people. I feel like, you're an ace in your place is what I like to say, Sean. You just love –
[0:19:30] SM: What is that?
[0:19:31] BB: It just means like, your gift for the world, you're doing it and you're doing it hard and you're loving it. You're in it. You're good.
[0:19:38] SM: I do like being in the world.
[0:19:40] BB: Oh, I'm freaking on it. Cool. Okay. Bullet points, or paragraphs in a pitch?
[0:19:45] SM: I'm fine with both. I send paragraph emails when I pitch stories to my editors. if I'm receiving one. Bullets are simple, but I'll read both.
[0:19:54] BB: Okay. Short or long pitches?
[0:19:57] SM: Same thing. Short is nice and to the point, but sometimes it's not enough. I will apologize for long email. I'll say, sorry for the long email, but it's important.
[0:20:06] BB: Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm. Okay. Images attached, or Dropbox zip file. Do we have a preference?
[0:20:10] SM: Yeah. Images attached, please.
[0:20:13] BB: Okay. Okay. One follow up, or multiple?
[0:20:16] SM: Two follow ups is acceptable. Three is where I draw the line.
[0:20:21] BB: Okay. Then, I bet I know the answer to this, but just to be clear, direct, or creative subject lines? I mean, I think it's going to be creative.
[0:20:27] SM: I like both. Direct is important for some of the stuff that I do, but I will usually respond better to creative.
[0:20:34] BB: Yeah. I was going to say, juice it up.
[0:20:36] SM: You got me pinned.
[0:20:37] BB: Juice it up. Okay, what about press release or media kit?
[0:20:41] SM: Press release almost always. Media kits are too long.
[0:20:44] BB: I agree.
[0:20:45] SM: Too much material.
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